The Art of Onboarding: How to Build a High-Performing Sales Team

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How do you provide a great onboarding experience? And how is that onboarding experience connected to the hiring process? I'm excited that today we are joined by Barrett King from Newbreed to discuss these topics. Barrett is a results driven leader with over 10 years of experience in building partnerships and executing go to market strategies for SaaS companies.

He's adept at creating and implementing sales and marketing plans that drive customer engagement and retention and has a proven track record of exceeding sales targets in delivering results in fast paced and competitive environments. Barrett is passionate about problem solving and enjoys the ever changing environment of growth stage companies.

Barrett. Welcome to [: 00:01:00

[00:01:01] Barrett King: Thanks for having me. I'm fired up to be here. It's a heck of an intro. I'm excited to have this conversation. This'll be fun.

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[00:01:11] Barrett King: Yeah, so my background's different. I think the way that I like to describe it, you know, in general is the idea of, I articulate it this way. So that, that green Lego mat we all had as kids, where you like built your ship or your house or whatever on top of. You know, I think about that as, The foundation you have when you exit primary education, which for me was a bachelor's of science with a focus in digital design.

So nothing like what I actually do for a living, although perhaps there's a correlation there. And when I graduated, you know, I, the house that I grew up in, I had a mother who was a marital and family therapist. I had a father who was a career salesperson. He was in high tech and had been, you know, certainly the, I think in many ways the leader that, That taught me, you know, what it meant to be a salesperson, right?

s saw sales as a, an avenue, [: 00:02:00

I like to think that I am in my head, but I'm not, I draw like stick figures and he had created this like photo realistic, just beautiful piece of art and I'm standing next to him. It's a very pivotal moment in my life. And I look over, his name's Pete. I said, Pete, man, I just, I envy your talent.

This is such an incredible piece of work. I'm so proud of you as a dear friend. Congratulations. And he looks at me, he goes, you envy me, and I wish I was like you. And I laughed and I went, no, you don't. I can draw stick figures. And he goes, no, maybe I'm a better, you know, traditional artist, and we kind of giggled.

And he said, but your words are your art. Never forget that. And I just remember being like, Whoa, I really hadn't thought about my talents and my skills and my abilities in that way. And I carried that forward. And so, you know, I graduated at a time when the market's not doing well, isn't a lot of jobs. So I go into restaurants and in hindsight, I can look back and say, I was starting to place Lego bricks on that mat.

career, I didn't do it in an [: 00:03:00

It's back in opening restaurants again. And then I went into an earlier stage tech startup that was selling to restaurants. And so I did a bunch of different things. Adding Lego bricks to my mat before I got to HubSpot where the last eight and a half years prior to where I'm at now, which I'll speak about is where my career sort of took off and where I started to grow a lot more of the sales specific skills.

So even in those startups, I was taking the different Legos, the experiences I had and, you know, leaning into sales as a career. Slightly resistant, frankly, because, you know, sales is a highs and lows game, right? And I think for a lot of us, we enjoy the highs and we dread the lows, you know, but ultimately the more that I embrace the opportunity, the more that I realized sales was exciting and sales was something I was passionate about and helping people through, you know, delivering value is what it became for me.

rships and sales leadership. [: 00:04:00

And now we can actually solve, we can actually do something to impact. So sales has been a journey and it's obviously going to continue to be one for me, but I think about it in context of, you know, having range and depth of my career and why those different components coming together is ultimately what.

You created this bigger opportunity for me overall.

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[00:04:54] Barrett King: It should have. Yeah, it probably should have. In hindsight, maybe I should have gone that direction. It's definitely interesting.

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[00:05:09] Barrett King: I think it has to be like, I, if you look at the way that sales has evolved, it's not single dimension. So what I mean is like, when you, if you go back, even like five years, if you were a salesperson, you knew the product, you were really good at it. You knew the solution and the discovery and the right.

Sort of aperture to take when you view the problem, but now you need to be an expert at the problem. You need to be an expert at the depth necessary to articulate, not just the opportunity, but the way that you're going to achieve the outcome for that customer. You need to, you know, own your brand, right?

You need to think about owning not just your own, uh, Information in the way that you know, sort of do your everyday selling and, you know, discovery and the sort of step by step tactical stuff. But the best salespeople own that the solution they provide, you know, you've got a marketing team behind it, but you yourself should be a marketer for your brand.

should own your product and [: 00:06:00

So like one of the things you saw big tech do really well before the pandemic and very much through it was they capitalized on the idea that inbound and content marketing could apply to talent to you could market the opportunities around your business. A lot of what I do here at new breed is around looking to attract the right fit talent to help us help our customers, which requires me to again, um, You know, in many ways, product market, because the product is our culture.

The product is our team and our efforts in the way that we actually go to market. I try and put that out on LinkedIn. I try and communicate that message too. So anyways, yeah, I mean, I joke and say, maybe I should have gone that route. Maybe I'm going that route already anyways, just for the sales lens.

I'm just fascinated by the, you know, the industry in that sense.

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[00:06:59] Barrett King: 100%.

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It's you can, in this day and age and technology, you can get a very lucrative job as a seller. And I think, but I think sales leadership is a calling for a lot of people. Like, what was it for you that made you want to go that route?

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That sounds like a very kind of fluffy answer, but it's true for me. I get energy from those interactions. So a lot of my career was in some ways, You know, sort of dotted with these moments where I helped a peer sell a deal. I helped, you know, uh, a colleague overcome a challenge. And then it started to evolve as I got more mature in my tenure and, [00:08:00] uh, and in my own skill set.

And then it was helping managers get better at managing. And I remember Being in this team lead program at one point and I was in the inaugural group and we sat in the room and sort of everyone said, well, what do you want to get from this? I just remember saying, like, I just want to help people and they were like, Oh, you're in the wrong career.

Like, it's not always about helping people. We got to drive revenue. You got to grow. And I just remember being like, yeah, I get that. Like, that's sort of table stakes part of it. But I really just want to help people be better, help people learn, help people grow in the way that they Sort of in many ways get to the places they want to be.

So I think for me, a lot of it's that, um, I will not forever be a sales leader. I enjoy it and I will do it as long as I am helping people and I am, I'm growing myself in the way that I want to. I'll be an IC again. I like being an IC. It's fun. You know, it's fun work with the customers. It's fun controlling your fate, but there's something special about, especially at the elevated level you know, you can get to, as you progress through leadership, the impact starts to grow.

nd we can certainly speak to [: 00:09:00

[00:09:11] Lucas Price: Yeah. Uh, you've had all this success in sales and sales leadership. Where did the what in your background gave you the drive to find this, that this level of success?

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I'm, you know, I'm 39 years old. So like high school graduation was 2003 for time reference for listeners. Right. I. You know, there were the jocks and there were the cheerleaders and there were the like nerds and there were like the kind of classic you joke about it. But like those categories of people that we bucketed our peers into.

as it. And I didn't actually [: 00:10:00

Like I didn't have to work that hard and I could get bees. And so from a grade perspective, that's suffice. Like no one really pushed anybody in the nineties and early two thousands. Like you just sort of existed the way you did. And so for me, you know, I go to college and I, you know, I go to one school, I go to state school here and I do some stuff and then I don't really love it.

And I go back for my second semester and I like it even less. I go back for year two and I hate it. And so I take a leave of absence. And I remember my parents being like, are you quitting school? I said, no, I'm not quitting school. And I'm like, well, it feels like it. You're giving up. No, I'm just going to figure out what I want to do.

And I went for a year and I worked a, you know, kind of standard blue collar job in a, in an office. If you will actually, it was like a, custom truck shop to be candid. And I just remember in those experiences thinking like, well, I don't want to do this. I know that. And so part of it was the like neutral attitude that was feeding this.

as like potentially my life. [: 00:11:00

But at the time, Every person around me just kept saying, but you got to go back to school. You got to go back to school. And so I went back to school and found a place in Florida and I moved down there and this is the defining moment for me. I moved to Florida. So like I, I apply to this college, I get accepted two weeks later, I tell my parents, I fly down two weeks after that and look at an apartment and two weeks later I quit my job and I moved my life to Florida.

and I'm like three thousands: 3000

But it was actually moving back home and working in restaurants that gave me the work ethic. So what's fascinating is, and I believe this, I've reflected on this quite a bit, the early career for me. So the early education and the early life stuff was [00:12:00] important to defining independence. then you add in this idea Of restaurant culture, which is like hospitality is intense and sometimes very brutal and very, you know, maddening, but very much team oriented and, you know, about the collective And just oriented on this idea of like, if you work hard, it's just enough.

Like there was no, you know, the hardest worker didn't win anything more. They were just seen as like a good employee. And so I just developed this insatiable appetite to do more, to work harder, to achieve more. And then I worked in startups. So you took like this crazy intense, Restaurant world of 3 p. m.

ind culture. This is like mid: 2000

And so I just carry that into the You know, career jobs I leaned into at that point. And then it went into, you know, the tech company I joined [00:13:00] HubSpot was 400 people when I joined, gosh, almost 10 years ago now and grew to 8, 000 employees while I was there. So with that level of growth, it's hustle, it's grind, it's work hard and it's achieve.

And I think, you know, for me, it's just at this point ingrained in my DNA,

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I felt like I was, you know, liked by everyone and sort of a connector between all the different groups, right. It didn't really belong to any of them. So striking, you know, another similarity that we talked about before, you know, as I listened to you talk about all this, the other thing that strikes me is that you're very thoughtful and perhaps as a leader, you want to get to the right answer and help people get to the right answer.

e's a saying that's escaping [: 00:14:00

Do I have that right? And if so, how's like, how has that, you know, helped you or affected you as a leader?

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Well, like it's repetition, pattern recognition, and, you know, being able to, I tend to think really quickly, like I described. So maybe it's a matter of I'm mindful because I'm moving fast, but I also think that the importance. Maybe inflection point in the way that startups have grown has changed. So I think about like my time in the startups I was at, you know, earlier on in my [00:15:00] career, it was what you're describing.

You know, indecision is the death of innovation and growth. Some version of that. And so perhaps I learned just to do it. Well, maybe even actually now I'm reflecting out loud, but maybe it was the restaurant thing. There's no time to stop and think, you know, you got to seat the guests, clear the table, start the party, serve the food.

It gets cold. Like there's all these speed based orientated oriented, excuse me, motions in that space already, and then you go to startups where, you know, the culture is that and will sort of forever be that. I think in many ways, you know, at new breed, we're fortunate to be at a growth stage.

So we're not startup. We've been in business for 15 years or so. We're 120 people or so. 15 20 people now at this point. So, you know, we're not tiny, but we're growing and we're growing very systematically. We're self funded, which means like we don't have P. E. Barking over our shoulders saying, do more, go faster, etcetera.

e. Sometimes I move too fast [: 00:16:00

I think if you look at it from a median sort of average perspective, you know, it matters because ultimately the decisions that we're making are They impact people, right? I remember I'd appear early in my career, say this software sign, you know, this software fundamentally changes people's lives. And then later in my career, someone said, you got to fall madly in love with the problem about a tech that we were selling.

And I combine those thoughts quite often in my head to. The idea of like, well, the work that we're doing in particular, Newbury, where I am now, we, you know, unlock meaningful growth for our customers. Those customers are sometimes it's a sass company doing something cool and that's great. It's an AI firm.

It's an innovative this or that. Sometimes they're like, um, you know, we had a company at one point that was turning Um, microplastics back into fuel, um, for like the sort of recycling system that was already in place in, um, a part of the world. I'll keep it kind of neutral to, for to not identify them, you know, fascinating, right?

nies, you know, net profits. [: 00:17:00

And so I very long winded answer, forgive me, but I am very passionate about trying to get that right. Because I, I have this like awesome sense of ownership and responsibility over the fact that. You know, a lot of these decisions have not just a single point of impact, but significant ripples. Thereafter

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[00:17:46] Barrett King: like lots of failure. I think when you look at organizations that don't have a intentional way of helping people become successful, like you used to hear it a lot. You still do actually the idea of like sink or swim. Oh, you're [00:18:00] great. We hired you because you're great. Go figure it out. I actually worked at a company once they called the figure out figure it out.

Factor. They literally said, we're not going to help you. Go figure it out. And when I, you know, in the moment I'm like, yeah, I'm going to work hard. It's like grind attitude, right? I'm going to, I'm going to get there and I'm going to make it work. And then, you know, as a perhaps adult at this point, and as a leader myself, I look back and go, that doesn't seem very smart.

Like you invested all of this cack in acquiring somebody who you believe is going to be successful. Why not empower them to their fullest ability to be successful and get as much value back out of that investment as possible. And so I think You know, for me, it was watching people fail and it was myself at times failing.

And, you know, because the system was missing, seeking it out, wanting it. And I actually, I think part of it is I was fortunate to be the first head of partner sales training at HubSpot. And then ultimately on part of the direct sales training, uh, responsibility, and then the sort of whole training, um, module for a period of time around sales.

ct of the way information is [: 00:19:00

But I think fundamentally, when you look at what you're trying to do, when you grow an organization, you have to disconnect headcount from growth at some point. And so earlier on, if you can be intentional around building assets and pathways and frameworks to empower, and then I think in many ways, try and systematize that to make it scalable, then imagine a world where every new hire was a predictable.

numerical impact on your business. And so I think about it in maybe three ways. One is like the front end LTV to CAC ratios of acquiring a new employee and trying to make them successful. The two is the material impact of doing that sooner than later from a financial perspective, but also the human impact, which is the part I care most about.

e with you. And so it's your [: 00:20:00

[00:20:03] Lucas Price: lots of great points there. Um, couple that I want to go down. I think it, you know, early on when an employee is brand new, like being hyper engaged with them, I think can do so much to get them on the right track and really like sink or swim, maybe some people will swim, but it'll probably take them. A lot longer to start swimming than it could otherwise.

And so you're wasting a lot of time in terms of ramping and stuff like that. But you talked about the way people learn like, and understanding how people learn, what are some of the things about that, that have like affected the way you deliver training or the way you engage with. A new seller.

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And then most folks from that point can tell you, [00:21:00] you know, what it is that they're like looking for, what they're best at. I think the interesting point around being aware of it is that And I like this is genuine. I mean this like I would love if I had resources every place I've ever worked and ever will work that I could dedicate to having do this full time.

Like the companies that have L and D teams that they invest in are smart because those are instructional designers and educators that Understand that there is a differentiated way that every person consumes information. Like let's be real here at our core we're machines. And if we don't figure out how the machine takes in data, that's kind of a problem.

And so it's changed the way that I interact with my peers in the way that I interact with the folks that work around me and, um, it feels weird to say for me, but I guess in some ways they are. And so, you know, when I think about the team that I get the chance to work with every day here and I haven't, you know, in other jobs and other roles, it's important because.

ion is consumed differently, [: 00:22:00

And when it doesn't, it's going to cost you more money. So there's your capitalist version, right? Then there's like the overly indexed on human part, which is like, it's unfair to the person. So if I show up and I assume that every time I interact with you, you can hear me when I talk at you like this, right?

Like I, like, I know many a one on one I've sat in and I've been like, what did that person say? I just tuned out. I got tired of hearing their voice, right? There is a world in which there's a, you could over index and be like, it's not fair to the people. It doesn't help the people. It's about the people.

which yields better employee [: 00:23:00

Which helps us grow our business more effectively.

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You know, that in, in studies, you know, people Learn better by reading than by listening. Even the people who think that they learn better by listening actually learn better by reading and that the learning style is more of like what you enjoy doing versus what the way that you better learn. Have you heard these ideas?

Have you come across this or experience this at all?

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In the world, like we're all a little different, but the truth is. And to your point, It's an interesting question. Does learning style matter or does the fact that the person leans into that style matter? And it's, for me, it's the second part of that. So like the person we're describing that says, Oh gosh, I do really well when I get, you know, auditory based, could you just record what you're going to send to me instead of emailing me?

And I go, yeah, sure. And I take nine seconds on my phone and I record a voice message and I Slack it over to the person or I use, you know, use the UI and do it that way. And they go, Oh, so great. I just listened to that on the way to go pick up my kids. And you're like, yeah. So really you just didn't want to text and drive or email and drive or cool.

computational perspective as [: 00:25:00

To your point, they don't retain perhaps all the words as well as they might reading it, for example, sake. But frankly, if You know, Bill or Sally in this example, right? Whoever this person is leans into the idea of consuming information that way, then fine. Maybe they don't retain as much to the point of like a test standard, but I get better employee engagement and they feel more fulfilled or more heard or, you know, have a better experience still a win for me because it means I'll show up the next time.

So, you know, at its core, If I'll use myself, like I consume information at a high rate of speed. I can read it. I can hear it. Um, and I can converse on it. I enjoy conversing most. I can consume it through reading probably the most effectively. And I least enjoy just listening. I'm aware of that, right? So I index towards like, let's hop on a quick phone call.

Let's jump on a quick zoom. Some of my peers don't love that. And that's okay too. In any event, I know that if you say to me and become the person that calls me, like I've had, you know, folks that. That just they do it to me still like they'll just call my cell phone. They want to ask me something to call my cell phone.

I'm like, [: 00:26:00

There's a trigger, there's a behavior, and there's a reward. If the reward is that the person. For you, for this teacher, if you will, as trainer this instance, the reward is that person is more engaged or that person gets you the results that you're looking for. And the trigger is I need to transfer information.

Who cares what the habit loop is. I don't care if they need to listen to me versus read for me. Like if it helps us become better, I'm all it

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[00:26:47] Barrett King: Yeah. So we have a rubric that we developed that looks at core attributes for success. And there is a rating scale. The new hires are aware of it, but it's a little bit of like a pass fail. I mean, there's numbers, but it's more of a pass fail in that [00:27:00] sense. However, we do identify, we try to at least we aim to, um, the characteristics of that individual through their interview that sense.

Would certainly impact the way they go through an onboarding and through an ongoing training process. So this is really great new hire we had recently. And in their new hire presentation, they crafted, this is so cool. They crafted a presentation using our brand. that we were convinced someone had given them like our slides.

It wasn't perfect, but it felt act looked at it was our logo. It was our color scheme. It was even our, um, we think it was our font and it was our layout and like our flow. So afterwards we asked, we said to this person, like, did you get this from somebody? I said no. I just, I looked on the internet.

ocess, but like crassly put, [: 00:28:00

Like that's kind of a wow moment. That's brilliant. And now they're in their onboarding and they're doing a really good job of learning from their peers and listening to calls. And just the other day came to me and said, Hey, I figured out how to get us in on some new. Um, uncontested RFP opportunities like, what, where did you find this?

Oh, I was. And it's, again, it's that entrepreneurial attitude, the spirit of like, I'm going to go figure something out. So now what I do is like, whenever I can, and I'm talking to this person, I try and present ideas that I'm thinking about, or I listed ideas from them. And that's all because I'm realizing that they're a creative thinker.

They're a hard worker and they're also like a little bit different in the way that they approach problems. And I love that, right? Diverse thinking is really important to me as a leader. So while I don't always try and say I have to adapt perhaps to a learning style, like I, frankly, I don't have L and D team members.

ly the thing that I take the [: 00:29:00

How do they interact with their peers? And how can we be adaptive, intentional? And deliberate around the way that we sort of go to market with them, right? How do we empower them to be the best way that they, or excuse me, the best version of themselves and the way that they can most effectively do that.

And that is again, informed by this idea of like carrying through their experience and beyond all the insights we gleaned from early and first conversations.

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[00:29:39] Barrett King: Correct.

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And, you know, there are these extra things or these other things that I think would be best for this individual.

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Cause if you think about like the average new hire, they join your business. They are still Whatever version of themselves they are coming from, like whatever that company was, industry, company, other role. I actually talked to my team a lot about this, which is like go to linked in, look at somebody's linked in and unless they've been in their role more than two years, they are still the persona of who they were before that.

So like, I love when someone says, well, it's the CMO on the call. And I'm like, cool. That person is probably more like a director of marketing in terms of experience. They've been in the role for eight months, right? Same thing's true for new hires. You have to unlearn a lot of the stuff, not always bad, not always good.

ent time consuming prior to. [: 00:31:00

So now we're moving beyond the science. The art comes in when you start to look at the extra stuff. So for right now, like live, and this is what are we April end of April, 2024, right? Uh, two of my new hires soon to be a third, get an hour a week with myself and a manager that works and we do essentially a, it's a, An open session, if you will.

It's not a Q and a, we bring topics, but it's training. It's developmental. It's meant to help them get better, but it's ad hoc. It's not in a program. We don't have it, you know, in a curriculum it is recorded so we can share it with other people. But like just this week we talked about, let's do the fundamental new breed pitch again.

best question, an exercise I [: 00:32:00

How do we learn to get more creative, more artistic? How do we get more flexible in our process? It's not a curriculum. It's not on a playbook somewhere. It's just human beings being people. And so for me, it was a combination of taking what these two new hires had done in their earlier in the first couple of weeks of their job, plus in their interviews and saying, team, would this feel good?

I, it wasn't my idea to be clear, but the manager that works with me came up with it. Absolutely brilliant. And so now we do this session that is ad hoc and natural and free, and it matters. It helps because then they, you know, they learn organically and they benefit from it.

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[00:32:52] Barrett King: It's too much too soon. And that's true in every onboarding program right now. I think we, you know, we're moving faster than we ever have as a species. That sounds [00:33:00] very scientific. I just mean like, as people, we're taking too many inputs right now. You've got social media, you've got your notification overload with Slack and email and every other platform on your phone.

You've got all of this. This stuff coming at you and then you're like, cool, we're gonna help you to like unlearn a bunch of stuff, relearn a bunch of new stuff. So volume first and foremost is volume. Um, the second part that I think is really important is context. So like at the risk of sounding like a pretentious jerk, you're not as smart as you think you are, Mr and Mrs leader.

Like I guarantee you are not. And Why I say that is like you are smart because you have perspective, you have exposure, you have experience. And so I'm using smart as a general term. Like we come in with this ego to onboarding of like, I'm going to teach you everything I know. No, you're not. Time will do that.

What you should do is give them the tools to learn really effectively in the framework of your organization. So what I do, and I really like this is the buddy system. I used to pair people up. I'd say, all right, new hire. You're with so and so I'm most tenured rep. That's old school thinking though. That tenured rep is old school.

siness for three years, five [: 00:34:00

And when I tell all of them, it's the same thing I tell new parents. I'm a dad, right? And so they say, you know, new parents go, well, what's the best advice you can give me? And I'm like, everyone's going to give you advice. Your job is to hear everyone and listen to no one, right? That's my like new baby advice.

Same thing's true for salespeople. Same thing's true for new leaders. Everyone's going to say, well, what I did and what I do and what you should do fine. Take it all in, but then formulate your own process. And I'm not saying that you shouldn't be within the guardrails, right? The expectations that you set in your onboarding, you need to run a discovery call.

your organization does. Um, [: 00:35:00

Gosh, we need to be more patient. We are so worried about time to value and so worried about ramping successfully and like One of my new hires right now is like 250 percent in their second month, crushing it. The other one already created two opportunities and they're in their second week. Great. But there's that old adage, and I'm going to get this wrong.

Um, I have to think of what it is actually going to bug me now. There's this. there's a farmer and someone comes to his farm and they say like, your horse got loose and you know, aren't you worried about that? And he's like, we'll see. And then, you know, his son comes home and he says, dad, the horse was downtown.

You know, what do I do? And he's like, well, you know, we could go find it. And it sounds like we got to go right now. And he's like, well, let's take our time and have dinner first. And then we'll go downtown. He goes, weren't you worried? It's going to get dark and the horse is going to get lost. And he goes, man, we'll see.

And so it goes on and on in this story. It's actually a kid's something. And at one point the Sun goes out and the sun gets hurt. They like, um, he breaks his ankle or bumps his foot or whatever it is. And the next day the army comes to the farm and they're conscripting people. They're going to bring them off to war or whatever.

old adage here, right? And, [: 00:36:00

And the farmer says, well, we'll see. And the whole idea of this whole thing, I did not do it justice. I hope somebody hears this and goes, you're wrong. Barrett and DMs me on LinkedIn and gives me the actual article. The whole point is like, we will see. So we get so caught up in this idea of like, you're going to be at this milestone and hit this KPI and hit this metric and that's all well and good.

But we have to remember, we are people. Onboarding is about helping people be the best version of themselves in your organization. So that requires patience and energy and a willingness to say, we'll see. Let it happen and let it manifest and let it exist and then make your decisions.

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[00:36:52] Barrett King: Oh yeah.

[: 00:36:53

And so, yeah, that I love the patience and the, we'll see, uh, start it to start to wrap us up here, Barrett. When you think about our conversation today, any key takeaways that you'd leave our listeners with?

[: 00:37:14

Let's try and focus on controlling the controllables and be a Be more framework oriented, be more guardrail oriented, be mindful and listen more. I always talk about active listening is the act of listening, but with the intent to understand, look to understand your new hires, look to understand, you know, the folks that work with you because the more you understand them, what motivates them, how they succeed, how they feel good, the more successful you're going to be.

on of our lives are spent at [: 00:38:00

And I think if you bring all of that attitude to your work as a sales leader. As a professional, you know, we're gonna have a better workforce and certainly a better world because of it.

[: 00:38:16

And, not giving them too much too soon and having the right level of patience in terms of onboarding people. Uh, so appreciate you sharing all that with us today. Where can people find you online?

[: 00:38:43

Um, I also have my own show called outcomes. It's a partnerships and SAS. So I talk with go to market leaders who. are in many ways, I think, trying to grow their organizations around the conversation we had. How do we be more effective, more invested, more intentional in the way that we go to market? It's micro, it's small, it's 20 minutes, it's tactical.

So you can find me on Spotify, Apple, all those places, but at its core, it's LinkedIn. Come connect with me. I'm glad to have a chat.

[: 00:39:22